[00:00:00] Speaker A: Hello and welcome to the interior design business. My name is Geoff Hayward and I'm here with my co host, Susie Rumbold, past president of the British Institute of Interior Design and creative Director of Tasuto Interiors, in front of a live audience of designers at Decorex 2025.
Thank you.
Today we will be looking at how interior designers can help their clients stay calm, relaxed and even tempered when working on a project.
[00:00:34] Speaker B: So the only things in life more stressful than building or renovating a home are bereavement, divorce and redundancy. And yet the finished result should be life changing for the client and worth all the pain of the experience.
To assist clients, interior designers must act as a safe pair of hands, ready to support and guide through the ups and downs, downs of the design and project process, skillfully managing any unforeseen dramas, problems or delays en route.
So how can we best prepare and manage our clients to minimize the stress for them and for ourselves and emerge successful and fated at the finish line? Welcome to the interior design business.
[00:01:22] Speaker A: And helping us with the discussion today, we are delighted to have with us two acclaimed interior designers. Helen Bygraves, co founder of Hill House Interiors, and Christian Benz, founder of Christian Benz. Welcome both to the show.
[00:01:36] Speaker C: Thank you.
[00:01:40] Speaker B: So before we begin, it would be just great if each of us, each of you could give us just a brief introduction to who you are, your practice, how long you've been in business and the sorts of projects that you undertake. Helen, do you want to go first? Yes.
So Hill House Interiors has been established for 28 years.
We mainly work at the high end, residential end of the property market. Ultra high net worth individuals. We have worked on boats, small spas and boutique hotels as well.
We have practices in London and Dubai and we work worldwide. We don't just work in those countries, we work all over the world.
Amazing. And Christian?
[00:02:19] Speaker C: Yeah. Hi, I'm Christian Benz. I'm a South African born interior designer. I've been in London for the last 10 years.
My studio is only five years old.
But yeah, we are predominantly residential interior designers. We like to describe our clients as those who are building their forever home.
So I think today's topic's quite good. We definitely encounter that sort of stressfulness that people sort of take on doing their own home. But yeah, we work on both local and international projects. But predominantly, yeah, forever homes.
And yeah, gorgeous.
[00:02:53] Speaker B: Gorgeous.
[00:02:54] Speaker A: And Helen, what is it about renovating a home that clients do find so stressful?
[00:03:00] Speaker B: Well, quite often a lot of families are moving out of their existing home or moving into A new home. So sometimes there can be that. Moving out and finding another place to live while they completely renovate or move into a new home.
There's often terminology in the business world that we work in that perhaps everyday clients don't understand.
There's obviously the financial side and obviously with that comes a lot of unknowns for a lot of people.
So I think, you know, our job is to make all of that very clear and to ease their path through it, actually.
[00:03:38] Speaker A: And Christian, do you think it's a super stressful experience in your experience?
[00:03:42] Speaker C: I.
So a couple of things. One, I think, yes, there's a lot around moving a house and changing a location, as you mentioned, be it schools or kids, all that jazz. You'd hope the interior design process is not stressful.
You know, you used that, your opening line, talking about like, bereavement, divorce and renovating a home. Like, I would really hope that if somebody has hired an interior designer, they are not liking it to death in the family.
And, you know, it's like, surely not, you know, And I think our job as interior design is obviously to try and, you know, cut the stress out of what we do to make our process as streamlined for the client, because there will be other stresses that they have to deal with and have to encounter the financial elements, the family elements and all that. But actually, those aren't really part of the job of an interior designer, you know, So I would say, however they become one, they do become, obviously by proxy and by virtue, you sort of deal with it. But I think, yeah, you would hope that the design process is not, you know, akin to divorce if you're paying a lot of money for an interior designer to do it. Yeah.
[00:04:50] Speaker B: Yeah.
So I know many interior designers and probably some members of our audience are often career changes that come to interior design as a career later in life.
Do you think that this extra life experience that those career changing designers have gives them an advantage?
Yes, for me, I had a career change. I trained in dance, I worked in aviation.
And what I would say is that all those skills that I picked up, be it discipline, different cultures, dealing with anxious clients, reassuring them those life skills have probably been crucial to where we've got to today.
Because I think understanding your clients, really getting into their mindset and sort of dealing with any issues that they have are almost as big a part of the job as the interior design itself. Yeah. So I would say 100%, yes. And Christian, anything that you want to.
[00:05:48] Speaker C: Add on to that one, I'm on the opposite. I'M a career interior designer, so I did it three year degree straight out of school and then worked my whole life in it. So, you know, we do employ a lot of other designers who have a background and I think so often, you know, my skill, I think why people hire us is that because we are interior designers. That is it. You know, we're good at our job and, you know, sometimes bonding with a client on something, when I'm perhaps not from a, you know, corporate world, you sometimes don't sort of bond on that sort of level. Do I think it's a make or break? No. You know, we've got two footballer clients at the moment and I can tell you now I haven't spoken to them once about football. So there's certain things you just don't need to bond about and you can just do your job about it. But I do think that the noting, you know, the staff we have, the ones that have come with something else to offer other than interior design, I think definitely they, they do blend in and they become a bit more of an asset and those skills definitely work to their favor.
[00:06:48] Speaker B: Interesting.
[00:06:49] Speaker C: Don't fear.
[00:06:50] Speaker A: And how important, Christian, do you think it is to understand the concerns or potential concerns of other project stakeholders, children or other family relations? Perhaps we.
[00:07:01] Speaker C: So we have a quite an objective view of interior design when we start a project and I feel like part of that understanding the project phase of works, we need to feed a client information as well as them feeding us information.
And I think unless they tell us certain things to consider, we won't necessarily go out of our way to figure that out. You know, we do work in a very sort of personal environment and there is a level that you need to tread. And if the client doesn't want to talk about a certain family dynamic or they don't want to involve you in a conversation about family or friends or parents or whatever, it's not our role to do it. I think sometimes we need to be aware and be mindful of perhaps other things that are impacting their stress.
But we certainly don't ask them a list of questions about like, it's not in the brief. It's not in the brief unless it is in the brief and then we'll take it into consideration. But like, you know, if they have an ailing mother or they have a child who's misbehaved, unless they tell us, look, these things are going to impact your job.
You know, I think it's part of the client's responsibility to load that into us and us to be responsive to those.
[00:08:10] Speaker A: Same for you, Helen?
[00:08:11] Speaker B: No, actually, absolutely not. So, and I would actually say that we have quite an extensive list of questions that we ask a client before we ever embark on any project.
And the reason being is that we've learned over the years, maybe experience, that a lot of people don't always give you a very clear brief and then if you're not careful along the line, you could redo things several times over.
So we, we do quite a not so much a list of questions, but we have very intensive talks with our clients just to say about how they want to live. Maybe there's different dynamics we've done, we've worked with a lot of families that have different age groups within might be elderly relatives living in the same households. All sorts of things that you've got to consider.
And some of those are quite crucial to know from day one, because actually you could do a lot of work and end up going to do the work all again because the brief has changed. And then you have to have those awkward conversations about lost time, project delays and all sorts of things. So we're quite the opposite. We try and ask as many questions as possible and extract as much information as we can at an early stage. That leads me into my next question, which was going to be, if you have a stressy client or you have a client that perhaps is having a difficult time in their lives, their circumstances or extra things that you need to do, does that then get fed through into your fee proposal?
Well, no, because I like to think that we try and encompass and number of changes in that. I mean, you can't go on forever and you've obviously got extreme people. But I think most people, if it's written into the fee proposal that of course you're going to do two or three changes, not everything is going to suit, and if it's four, so be it, you know. But I think, you know, people have come to us, entrust us, there is a process and clearly we can't go on forever. But we largely understand that, you know, from a lot of clients, they need to understand what something's going to cost. They understand the parameters of how we work and try and sort of work to those guidelines wherever we can.
[00:10:23] Speaker C: Yeah, I think, yeah, if somebody comes to you, they're on their best behavior. So you only know you've got a stressy client later down the line, you know, you're not going to come for Doha. I'm going to be your worst nightmare.
[00:10:32] Speaker B: Also, I have had that. I Have actually had that said.
[00:10:35] Speaker C: So you don't know. So I think you're all right. You do have to sort of like plan, you know, you have to plan for the worst common denominator, make sure you've allowed for time extra so you aren't going, oh, sorry, you change your mind twice. We have to build you. So I think you take those elements in and you know, you also need to allow that space for, I think like for us, we might not go out of our way to ask a question if they suffer from anxiety, for example, but you do have to allow that opportunity for a client to come to you and say, look, I'm really battling. Can we perhaps, look, slow this process down or can we design it in a different way or do you mind if we just spend a little bit more time on that? And I think that's when you kind of have to take your years of experience and try add to your method of working. So when you do get that mad client, you go, oh shit, we didn't plan for that one. You adapt your methodology as you go, so you take into account the potential of that happening again.
And I think that then also just feels like for a client perspective that actually you are taking on board their experience and I think sometimes that goes a long way at sort of quelling their potential anxiety levels.
[00:11:43] Speaker A: Would you say that project budgets and timescales are two of the biggest points to get right right at the start?
[00:11:51] Speaker C: Yeah, I think so. Again, we might be slightly more cut and dry about certain things. Like I never ever, ever give a timeline on a project because we do forever homes. We know that if you're going to be living in a home for 15, 20 years, possibly longer, does a six month delay on a sofa or a rug or a builder actually make any difference? So we try and take the stress out of a delay, knowing that we're here for the long haul, we're doing the right answer. You need to look past those things. Obviously the financial element is something that is it real time? You can crawl back, you can live in it, you forget about it. At the end of the day, it's a financial element which I think is sometimes the biggest strain on a client. You know, whatever the level of project, I think on the most part is probably the most amount of money you're going to spend in one go.
And I think that's a really important thing to just try and navigate. And sometimes you can't control the cost of it. You know, we did a site visit today and you walk around and you lift up the floor and every single pipe needs to be redone. So the whole house needs to be. Be replumbed. We didn't know that six weeks ago. What are you going to do? Just close the floorboards and carry on? Yeah. You've got a spit, so you have to then go back. You can't be honest. You've got to be honest about it. So you. We are the middlemen and we are the messengers sometimes. And I think sometimes maybe interior designers feel like they take on all the responsibility. Yeah. And I, you know, if the house needs to be replumbed, that's not your fault. So like, yeah, interior designer, don't stress about it. Help the client navigate through that stress. Help them perhaps minimize the spend. Where can we value engineer elsewhere to make up some of that money? But it's not your fault that things go wrong.
[00:13:27] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:13:27] Speaker C: And I think sometimes you need to have a bit of a guard up because otherwise you have a stressy client and a flapping interior designer and that's not a good combo.
[00:13:34] Speaker B: Yes, I would. I was going to say that I think a lot of clients won't actually tell you their true budget anyway. From experience. I don't think I've ever had a client ever give me a reasonable budget that they'd be stuck to. And it's come in. I think most people have got a contingency plan. They don't like to tell their interior designer. But I think what's, you know, quite a clever way of doing it. Obviously it can stop the creative process if they don't give you that absolute sort of budget and you don't show them perhaps what could be achieved if you stick to that budget. So I think what we tend to do is say if we stick to your budget, you can have this, but there's also this and this at this level. And let them decide. Because invariably, and I've had many clients over the years more than double or treble their budget, but they didn't want to tell me that in the beginning. And I think from a designer perspective, that's really quite frustrating. If you could have shown them something that they could have had if they'd just been a bit more honest in the beginning. So I think keeping your client really well informed, keeping them aware of other things that are out there, a little bit more on their budget, I think it's really important to do that because actually you can exceed their expectations. And that's what as interior designers, we always want to do, exceed their expectations.
How important is it for a designer, in the interests of their own sanity to set boundaries between them and their erstwhile stressy clients.
[00:15:02] Speaker C: I think, yeah, that comes down to I don't know how you do it, but we've got a method of working and, and there's clear stages within that method of working. Obviously that method of working goes to fee proposal. And often we find that a client engages with the fee proposal because of the number associated. They sometimes forget to read the method of working. So it's our responsibility to sort of remind them every so often, this is a stage you're doing now, that's what you're going to get out of it. Then when you're done, are we about to move on to this next stage? Just a reminder, that's what we're going to do. And I think it goes alongside an invoice so they know paying move on to the next stage.
And yeah, I think it is a reminder for you to one for yourself to summarize where you're at and to go, okay, we're moving on to the next stage. But also just to the client to remind because most of our clients are, they work full time jobs. Both of them are working.
They'll come together to look at your presentation and then go on and carry on with their day.
They forget the overall arcing picture. They might forget the timeline, they might forget the sort of 27 processes to get from A to B. It's our day job, you know, we remember and we know everything. But sometimes you need to remind them to do it because it's the first time they've done it, they may not be familiar. So yeah, I think so that continuous sort of like updates, although boring and to sometimes quite a creative fluid world, you do have to just go back to those milestones and go, okay, we're moving on to this stage. And just a reminder, I don't do this or you don't do that or we're moving on to that now.
[00:16:30] Speaker A: You know, same for you, Helen.
[00:16:33] Speaker B: Yeah, I mean I would say that, you know, sticking to a plan, sticking to the way that you work is hugely important, but you do have to be a little bit flexible with everybody. And I would say that like for example, you were saying earlier about a potential problem, you know, there could be unforeseen things that could change the design process a little bit, delay it. I think honesty, honesty with your clients is the best policy. And communicating and telling your clients of what to expect when so exactly when I I'm seeing you today, we'll come back to you in two weeks time. In two weeks time, you'll have this, this, this and this. Yeah, it might. And I think that alleviates the stress for clients. They know what's happening next, never leaving that sort of silent time. When they go, what happens now?
[00:17:22] Speaker C: There's nothing worse than a client messing you, asking, what's happening now, what's happening now?
[00:17:26] Speaker B: By the time you've left that client, they've got a clear indication of what to expect next in the process and whether that's on time or slightly delayed for whatever reason that may be.
[00:17:36] Speaker A: Sofas and Stuff believe great design begins with choice. They partner with designers to create personalized made to order furniture crafted to enhance the way people live and feel in their homes. Each piece is handcrafted to order by their makers in Preston. With thousands of fabrics, including exclusive V and A&RHS collaborations, their 25 UK showrooms offer expert support to help bring design visions to life. Sofas and Stuff believe distinctive spaces are shaped by distinctive choices. And that's what they mean by choice, not compromise. It's the freedom to bring genuinely personal designs.
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[email protected] okay, so everything's going smoothly on the project?
[00:18:23] Speaker B: Yes.
[00:18:23] Speaker A: And you're getting an email now from your client at 10 o' clock on a Sunday evening. What do you do?
[00:18:29] Speaker B: Well, a lot of my clients and I do have this, we have this in our practice quite a lot.
And a lot of our clients are busy people. They may be emailing you at 10 o' clock on a Sunday night.
They don't expect an answer. Most people that are reasonable do not expect an answer. But it's the time when they can put their thoughts down or their ideas down or things that they want to relay to you in a time when they've got time to do it. So quite often they say, I'm writing this to you now, but I don't expect a response until Monday or Tuesday. Please don't think I do, but that suits my timeline when I can get back to you. And I think with any project, if that wants to go smoothly, it's very much a two way situation. It's your client and you communicating them, coming back to you on certain decisions.
Those things are quite crucial to keep the project on time. If they don't come back to you with their thoughts, that's going to delay the process.
And I'm very quick at saying I can only Deliver this maybe on a timescale that they want. As long as we communicate on time together. And if you're not quite sure, say you're not quite sure and we can discuss it together. So it's all about that relationship, keeping constant dialogue.
[00:19:45] Speaker A: Okay. Christian, is it the same for you?
[00:19:47] Speaker C: Yeah, I think an email is obviously an easy thing to ignore and I do agree, you know, getting an email back on a Sunday night is that they're having a glass of wine, probably discussing it and then they'll email you. The WhatsApps obviously are harder to navigate because that's like instant in your hand.
[00:20:01] Speaker B: WhatsApp is, especially in the Middle East.
[00:20:05] Speaker C: I personally don't mind it. I feel like very often if a client's going to message it is because they are both home together, they're having a conversation. They need an answer. And as you say about sometimes taking those moments to ensure the project doesn't delay further that we've got an answer, we can activate it first thing tomorrow morning rather than waiting for them to finish a board meeting, come back, write their notes and before you know it, it's two o' clock and the builders had another day of twiddling his thumbs. So you kind of have to take it when it comes. I do get. I do. I don't respond to a weekend message. I am quite firm with that.
[00:20:39] Speaker A: You draw the line there.
[00:20:40] Speaker C: I draw a line at that. Unless I don't day to day message me at nine o' clock saying, how are we together? Cool, can we chat? And usually they come with that precursor. Just discussing your latest email. Can we have a quick five minutes? Great. But if they're going to start like hounding you pictures or something on a Sunday afternoon, you're going like, mate, like, I've got a life as well, like, just like Joel.
[00:21:01] Speaker B: I think it's very important to keep the boundaries, but I think there are occasionally extreme circumstances where things happen and you do need to be slightly aware that those exceptional times might need an immediate response. Yeah, I think, you know, you've got to be sensible and weigh up. You know what?
[00:21:17] Speaker C: I don't think also, yeah, I wouldn't.
[00:21:18] Speaker B: Imagine what isn't at the weekends, really.
[00:21:21] Speaker C: I wouldn't imagine a client's going to take offense that their designer hasn't responded at Sunday at 3 o'.
[00:21:26] Speaker B: Clock.
[00:21:26] Speaker C: You know, like no one's going to be upset about it. But, you know, I think you have to have. You either open the door to that and you allow it to happen. I know some designers would Sit here and say, not a chance. I won't even give a client my cell phone number. So, you know, it's very. It depends on how you want to roll it, but I think it's an asset, and I think sometimes it allows for going back to the topic at hand, sort of minimizing stress. Sometimes creating a little bit of stress for you by having a client who can contact you whenever does sometimes take the stress out of their day. And actually, chances are that stress is less than the stress you might be feeling.
[00:22:03] Speaker B: I also think because we work on lots of time zones as well.
[00:22:05] Speaker A: Of course you do.
[00:22:06] Speaker B: So for us, sometimes it's inevitable that emails or whatsapps or whatever are going to come in at unusual times of the day for us. Again, I don't think all the clients are expecting a feedback straight away, but we do quite a lot with America at the moment. So we're coming to the end of our day. They're just getting up and we get a barrage at that time. So when we're doing those sort of projects, sometimes you have to be a bit flexible and maybe you know, even sort of say to your designers, do you mind working some later evenings or whatever that may be, just to fix it in with the program. Okay. What do you do about clients that are terrified of making decisions for fear of making an expensive mistake?
So I make them for them.
[00:22:51] Speaker C: Yeah.
I think a lot of the time as interior designers, a client might feel that they're making. They're starting to make decisions. When you start feeding them decisions to make, and everyone goes, oh, we making decisions. This is getting real now. And I often tell a client, like, I'm like, the day you bought this house, you started making a decision. Let's not forget that you've already. There's not some, like, line in the sand now where your interior designer is making you sign in blood. You already made the decision. You've bought this house. Then you made a decision when you hired the architect. Then you made a decision when you hired the interior designer. These decisions are getting easier and easier and easier to make. Don't look at it the other way around. Just going harder and harder and harder. Like you can. You can get rid of a cushion without paying stamp duty. You want to get rid of your house because you made a mistake. There was a far bigger issue f up than whatever I'm going to show you. So just, like, chill.
[00:23:45] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:23:45] Speaker C: These are not forever decisions. They can be changed. And if you approach what should be the joyous side of a project with this trepidation, that shit. Now I have to pick a paint color. Oh, it's like, that is. Then you've got bigger problems to add here, I think.
[00:24:02] Speaker B: Remind your client why they've chosen you in the first place and just say, put your faith in what we're saying. Put your. Because there's gotta be a leap of faith at some point. And I think encouraging your client to do that.
And we do a lot of computer generated images in our studio. In fact, we got three in house visualizers and that really does help the process. We build that into our fee proposal. And I actually find that that really helps the client see it. Yes. Giving them that visualization of, oh, it's going to like that. Oh, that's okay then. So that is a huge asset to do. And you know, more and more people expect that right from the offset now in your design fee proposal.
[00:24:46] Speaker A: So there's always immense optimism at the start of a project.
[00:24:49] Speaker B: Yes.
[00:24:51] Speaker A: How should designers go about managing their clients expectations?
[00:24:56] Speaker B: Well, I think champion the wins, you know, if you've just got, if you've just got planning or something you can get done in time, in the time scale they want that they absolutely love, you know, celebrate those wins because keep their enthusiasm, you know, keep up the humor, you know, keep the enthusiasm. And I think the enthusiasm can come from the designer themselves. You absolutely love what you do as a designer and it's coming through. And what you're showing your clients, they're going to be excited as well. Okay. They're going to love what they see. They're going to be. And as I say, it's showing them a cgi that is a moment where they get huge enthusiasm because they can see the end goal.
[00:25:36] Speaker A: Keep the passion burning.
[00:25:37] Speaker B: Keep the passion burning as much as you can. Yes.
[00:25:40] Speaker C: Yeah. I think on a practical term, I think managing expectations, communication is obviously key, but we tend to try. And our ideal project is one where we present a client with the concept for each space.
We don't necessarily spend a huge amount of time at the offset getting into the nitty gritty. We get them to buy into the essence of each room and then we progress the design with them. And I think what that does, it also allows us to be nimble, but it also just allows the client a continued period of interaction until they get to a point where they go, okay, actually decisions are made. I can hand it over to you.
Rather than feeling like they're getting spoon fed or force fed, rather a design then going, I haven't really bought into it but the guys are really painting that wall that color or the builders are really doing that thing. They feel a little bit out of sorts. So by sort of feeling like you haven't made any decisions or any firm decisions until all of a sudden they are made, I think that's a way that we sort of encourage or sort of stretch out that enthusiasm with the client and it sort of makes them feel a little bit more at ease that you're not being like signing on the dotted line on day one, that there's a sort of motion to travel through and then you go, oh well we've got to this point like obviously we're painting the room that color, you know, and they felt like they got there at the end rather than being.
[00:26:58] Speaker B: Told, let them think it's their decision.
[00:27:00] Speaker C: A lot of that.
[00:27:01] Speaker A: Yeah, a lot of that. Interesting.
[00:27:03] Speaker B: But I think it is a process and it is, it is a two way, it's very much a relationship between you and your client. And this is where, you know, psychology is a huge part of what we do. Right.
[00:27:14] Speaker A: Psychiatry. Some might say.
[00:27:15] Speaker B: Absolutely. So I, I would say, you know, showing all the products as you say along the way and knowing the ones they absolutely love or. Oh, I'm not quite sure of that gives you a really good feel for the client as you're working with them throughout the process. But yeah, psychology is massive. Yeah, yeah. So during that kind of all important build phase, do you set any kind of ground rules for your clients about you know, things that they should and shouldn't do? You know, not going on site or not issuing instructions? I mean obviously, you know, in terms of issuing any instructors instructions to the builders. Of course. Yes. Because some people say oh no, I actually have changed my mind, knock that wall down. But I think it's just making sure that there's a chain of communication between yourselves. The product manager, it might be the construction site manager, all those things. Because you know, one decision is sometimes naively taken without realizing a knock on effect. So it could affect the M and E. It could affect any number of things. The cost. So yes, structure. The structure. Structure.
[00:28:23] Speaker C: We try have at least, you know, if we're going to have a weekly site meeting, there'll be weekly site meetings with all the team that doesn't include the clients. And then you have those meetings would do. And they are very often two different types of meetings.
[00:28:37] Speaker B: Definitely.
[00:28:38] Speaker C: One is problem solving, dealing, doing and the other one is showing and yeah, viewing progress, asking a client a question, giving them the opportunity if there is a problem to be solved. How do we solve it? Here are options. Look at the client. You know, there's nothing worse than an excitable client walking through a door behind you and the plumber's looking at their covered in water going, oh, I've hit something. And you're kind of going, okay, just go away outside, let me deal with this problem with the. And they will come back to you. And then, you know, as you say, they kind of go, well, try to solve a problem one way because it might look wrong. And then actually your aircon's buggered, your lights are changed and all sorts of stuff. So you kind of have to, you know, some clients couldn't be bothered and you have to drag them to site. And some clients want to be there all the time.
[00:29:23] Speaker B: Yes.
[00:29:24] Speaker C: But I do think there is a, there is a distinct separation when you go, you'll get the best Mr. Client out of this project if you only attend on the Wednesday, but the rest of the team are coming on a Monday and we're going to do what we need to do.
[00:29:36] Speaker B: Health and safety is a great one.
[00:29:38] Speaker C: Sorry, not allowed.
[00:29:39] Speaker B: Health and safety, Health and safety.
[00:29:41] Speaker C: Blame on them.
[00:29:42] Speaker A: And are there any particular stress points that happen on a project timeline where designers need to be really super wary and how would they, how would you handle those?
[00:29:52] Speaker B: You know, over the last five, ten years, I mean it's only showed with COVID lack of materials, Suez Canal, any number of things could affect a program. So 100%. But this is where honesty is the best answer. And also if a client wants to choose something that's going to be extranet, you know, extraordinary length of time to procure and to get in and to manufacture, to be honest about that, because some people make the decision. Well, I'm happy to wait a bit like you were saying earlier, I'm happy to wait for that. So honesty is always the best policy and things are going to happen. And make yourself make your client aware that some things are just outside of your control.
And there's always a solution though, you know, I always say every negative can have a positive.
So if there is something that goes wrong, we're here to also find solutions for our clients. And no, not necessarily. Is it always a bad thing?
[00:30:48] Speaker A: So being positive about it really helps to.
[00:30:50] Speaker B: 100%. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[00:30:52] Speaker C: I think, yeah, I would say for a client point of view, I think you would hope that we shield them a lot from that stress and actually that we can drip feed certain things and some, some problems you can solve on your own. And some problems you have to go to the client with. I think, you know, one of the things that sort of keeps me sane is knowing that I'm just the messenger very often, and it's. If there's a delivery delay or there's a container stuck somewhere or whatever the case is. Actually, it's just all I can do is tell you the problem and I can't actually take the blame for it.
[00:31:20] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:31:21] Speaker C: I think a lot of the time where things are super frustrating and stressful for us is when actually we've accidentally let a reserve slip and then the fabric you wanted for your scheme is now no longer, you know, so there are those things which. They're just the stresses of being an interior designer that we have to navigate. And, you know, our first sort of step is to try and resolve it without letting the client know. Because I don't think you need to let the client know everything. You know, it's our job. Pick and choose.
[00:31:49] Speaker B: I think you should. Yeah, definitely.
[00:31:51] Speaker C: Very often clients actually don't know if you change a fabric. Like, I'll tell you that now. I have changed curtains and all sorts. Yeah. But I. But in that. In that specific project, we were quite free and we knew the client just wanted the right answer, not necessarily the nice answer, and we could do it. But, yeah, I think it's knowing when to keep quiet and solve the problem and knowing when you need to bring the client in. Because you.
At every turn on any project, we look back and go, how could we have improved the situation? I think it always just comes down to that. We should have just been honest earlier.
And sometimes you just don't need to be honest, but sometimes you do.
[00:32:31] Speaker B: Yeah. I'd also say in 28 years, I think I've seen quite a lot of things go wrong. So I think I've got quite a few tips up my sleeve of how to sort them out.
What are the best ways for the designer to communicate progress and potential problems to their clients?
[00:32:48] Speaker C: We do. So after every site meeting, we go and collate basically a mini interior design report.
And part of that is these are the topics we discussed. These are the actions you need to. Action. So at least at the end of that day, nobody's like twiddling their thumbs or waiting, did they?
I'm overhearing a conversation about changing where the tap went, but nobody's actually instructed me to do it. So just creates a day by day, a week by week. Sort of like mini brief. And then at the end of every month, we do an interior Design report, which then just also outlines anything, the discussion we've had. If there's any potential delay because we might make a decision about moving something on the day, everyone goes, yeah, fine, you can do it. But then actually that comes with a knock, on which you only find out two weeks down the line. So those points you kind of have to go, okay, well the decision's been made. We have to just now live with the delay. But you do need to then capture that at some point. So it is sort of one of those, like, you know, trying to sum up the week or sum up the month and just do these really easy to navigate reports and stuff. Sometimes those reports get absorbed into the PM or the architect, sort of like big weekly agenda thing needs to tinsel. But I find sometimes an interior designer, a couple of bullet points in language the client understands is sometimes just an easy to read, like digestible thing where they go, I'm quickly brought up to speed and I get the process.
[00:34:11] Speaker B: Yes. I mean, we email all the time and update the client all the time. And there's Gantt charts and things like that that a client can look at and see that knock on effect. But you know, even at the time of that decision, you're going to knock back down or do something, you know, explaining to your client that that's all, all feasible. But just remember there will be a delay. Yeah. Because of what you're going to do. And I think just, just again, honesty, transparency and communication.
[00:34:40] Speaker A: So I'm getting that loud and clear from you, Helen.
[00:34:43] Speaker B: Yes.
[00:34:43] Speaker A: And is there any other advice you'd have for maintaining a client's trust or their appreciation through thick and thin?
[00:34:50] Speaker B: Humor.
[00:34:51] Speaker A: Humor.
[00:34:52] Speaker B: I think humor is really good. Yeah.
[00:34:54] Speaker A: Tell them some good jokes.
[00:34:56] Speaker B: Yeah. Yes. And I mean, you know, along the way you engage with your client, you get to know their likes and dislikes, maybe bring in other things into the equation. It might be the theater, it might be, I don't know, restaurants. It might be something that you found. You, you know, you've got some common ground in bringing those things into, into the way because you're building up a relationship not just about interior design, but many other things as well.
[00:35:20] Speaker A: Yeah. So building a relationship, that's what like.
[00:35:23] Speaker C: Often you'll often have need to have a conversation with a client where they feel guilty about wanting to change something. And I often find, like, if I know that calls coming in where the client wants to chat about extras or changes, you don't jump straight into it. You're like, you disarm them and Disarm yourself. You tell a joke, ask how the day is going, you make a joke about this, and then you go, okay, let's crack on. And then they feel more free, more comfortable, more at ease. And then you don't have this, like, you have your guard up. They nervous about coming to you because you got your guard up.
And then it becomes this, like, awkward conversation. I think you always have to sort of read the crowd, read the room, and know when you need to just, like, disarm yourself to disarm them. And then actually you realize that, like, what you're doing is quite an easy job. To be honest, it's really quite basic what we do. It's a lot of decisions, a lot of work, but actually, at the end of the day, we just want someone of a really nice house and a really lovely life.
[00:36:18] Speaker B: And also, I think, you know, for me, I always look at a project and I think, how would I feel if that was my home? How would I feel if someone's saying that to me and I react to my clients the way I would want to be reacted to myself? I put myself in those exact shoes and I. I deal with it as if it's my own problem, and I think that's the best way I can deal with it.
[00:36:40] Speaker A: Some great advice there. Thank you. Round of applause, please, for our panel.
Thank you very much.
[00:36:47] Speaker B: I just wanted to say thank you so much to our fantastic guests, Helen and Christian, for their time today. It's been a fascinating and informative conversation. So my appreciation.
[00:36:56] Speaker A: Hugely brilliant.
[00:36:57] Speaker C: Yes.
[00:36:57] Speaker A: Thank you so much. And thank you also to decorex for hosting us here today at London Olympia. And a final thank you to you, our audience. We do hope you've enjoyed the episode and please do get in touch on our social channels. Nteriordesign BusinessPod to share any feedback. The interior design business is a Wildwood plus production. Thank you very much.
